JNC Writing Support Group
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@Alfaerin Thanks. I've made the reply and added something to test this works. I suspect the main push will come next week after the first round announcements are made (even though everyone here will get through).
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Linky-dink to review thread—Click Me!
@Alfaerin said in [https://forums.j-novel.club/topic/7938/jnc-writing-group-feedback-thread):
Alright, the review thread is officially live! As mentioned in the new topic, please wait for @Damon-Cavalchini to post the first response. That post will be edited to include a list of works awaiting review. Let me know if anyone has any questions, corrections, or suggestions!
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Welcome to announcement weekend everyone. Although, given the Easter holidays around the world, I wouldn’t be surprised if the announcement was delayed by a week or so.
Still, fingers crossed and hopes for everyone here.
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@Damon-Cavalchini said in JNC Writing Support Group:
I wouldn’t be surprised if the announcement was delayed by a week or so.
On that note, Sam mentioned on Discord (link if you partake) that they're a little behind on where they want to be on the judging.
I will however promise an email by the end of the month
MAYBE that email will explain how we need some more time
and give a progress report
But I dunno maybe I will finish perfecting my hyperbolic time chamberSo don't be surprised Pikachu if you have to wait a bit longer. Its good in my opinion that they take whatever time they need to give everyone a proper shot.
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@Hylebos - I completely agree. I’d prefer every story was fairly and equally considered.
It is not as though there is anything I can do about it anyway.
Won’t stop me regularly checking my email this weekend though :)
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I am not sure if there is a good way to do this: Spoiled ten-year-old girl, who is essentially a princess, would sneak out of a castle/estate to see what life is like in her maid’s home in a shantytown. She needs to get out of the walled estate and back without being missed and not be discovered a s princess during her trip.
I am playing this straight—not for humor—it needs to be believable for her age and no magic.
Ideas:- Feigning illness and pretending to be a maid on leave. Guessing that the maid that she is visiting would also be sneaking out. Folks would have to believe her maid is taking care of her room.
- Going on an outing with castle’s one female knight and convincing her to go with her. The female knight is rather large —would she be less conspicuous in the shantytown dressed as a maid or a man?
- sneak out in a provisions cart—this was done in the previous volume to sneak to a market—but I would think she would have to hop out of the cart in transit—which might be a bit much. Would need a cover for the time she is gone. How would you make her not be missed.
Also, would a maid on leave wear a maid uniform or street clothes? Does it matter? Would it make sense to have a male relative to meet her to take her to the shantytown or would she walk unattended? How much of this do I have to explain to be believable?
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@jazzyjeoff said in JNC Writing Support Group:
I am not sure if there is a good way to do this: Spoiled ten-year-old girl, who is essentially a princess, would sneak out of a castle/estate to see what life is like in her maid’s home in a shantytown. She needs to get out of the walled estate and back without being missed and not be discovered a s princess during her trip.
I am playing this straight—not for humor—it needs to be believable for her age and no magic.
Ideas:- Feigning illness and pretending to be a maid on leave. Guessing that the maid that she is visiting would also be sneaking out. Folks would have to believe her maid is taking care of her room.
- Going on an outing with castle’s one female knight and convincing her to go with her. The female knight is rather large —would she be less conspicuous in the shantytown dressed as a maid or a man?
- sneak out in a provisions cart—this was done in the previous volume to sneak to a market—but I would think she would have to hop out of the cart in transit—which might be a bit much. Would need a cover for the time she is gone. How would you make her not be missed.
Also, would a maid on leave wear a maid uniform or street clothes? Does it matter? Would it make sense to have a male relative to meet her to take her to the shantytown or would she walk unattended? How much of this do I have to explain to be believable?
With regards to 1) and your follow up questions, I don't know if a spoiled ten-year-old would have the knowhow to convincingly emulate a maid, unless the manners of the nobility and the maids are close enough. I feel as though a maid wearing maid clothes would be seen as on-business for the estate rather than being on leave, and procuring casual clothes for the outing would be an extra layer of difficulty. Whether or not a ten-year-old maid can walk unattended depends on the relative safety of your setting.
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seems the most likely, as you can lean on the knight being an adult and having a better idea of how to do things so it isn't purely the spoiled ten-year-old doing all the planning and leg work would lend whatever plan they come up with a lot more credence. Depends on the knight's background, of course.
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could work as long as it's clear to the reader she is casually using a mechanism she hopes to use repeatedly in the future rather than being disappointed that the author is repeating a plot that worked, though I can't think of any ideas for how to cover her absence in a way that works. Maybe this is the time she's finally caught?
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If you want to be realistic, I think option two with the guard dressed as a man would definitely be the most plausible. Having a cooperative adult who can help her navigate the obstacles massively increases her chances of success. When you say "maid," I assume you mean a lady's maid as opposed to say a scullery maid? A lady's maid is a much higher and better paid position, since it requires a great deal more knowledge and skill. They would be better dressed as well, and stick out like a sore thumb in a shanty town. It would be even harder for your princess convincingly pass herself off as one, too. Even if her face isn't recognizable, her mannerisms as a princess would likely give her away as not being a commoner. It's also difficult to imagine a ten year old possessing the skills and training needed to serve as a lady's maid. Anyone who met her should be suspicious and skeptical that she is who she's pretending to be, unless they're deliberately turning a blind eye. Another option for her sneaking out might be a secret passage used for emergency escape, though you might need to explain why she didn't consider this option before.
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@Alfaerin said in JNC Writing Support Group:
If you want to be realistic, I think option two with the guard dressed as a man would definitely be the most plausible. Having a cooperative adult who can help her navigate the obstacles massively increases her chances of success. When you say "maid," I assume you mean a lady's maid as opposed to say a scullery maid? A lady's maid is a much higher and better paid position, since it requires a great deal more knowledge and skill. They would be better dressed as well, and stick out like a sore thumb in a shanty town. It would be even harder for your princess convincingly pass herself off as one, too. Even if her face isn't recognizable, her mannerisms as a princess would likely give her away as not being a commoner. It's also difficult to imagine a ten year old possessing the skills and training needed to serve as a lady's maid. Anyone who met her should be suspicious and skeptical that she is who she's pretending to be, unless they're deliberately turning a blind eye. Another option for her sneaking out might be a secret passage used for emergency escape, though you might need to explain why she didn't consider this option before.
The way I wrote it is that since she is just ten, she doesn't have ladies in waiting—there is just a head maid (nanny) and junior maids who have no status. So the maid that she would be leaving with is a junior maid—and the “princess” would be pretending to be a junior maid-sculiry maid. (FWIW, she would not be a princess (duke’s daughter) until she is confirmed in the church at age 12). Other than distinctive looks—acting like a commoner won't be that hard (for reasons).
The downside of option 2 is a loss of drama and tedious logistics—part of the fun of having the protagonist be a child is that she does not have an adult’s appreciation of risk—and would go into a shantytown only accompanied by a junior maid. In other words, ten-year-olds do stupid things—and I want to embrace that! I just need a plausible way to get her out of the estate for 8ish hours disguised as a lower level maid—she can even fail spectacularly once she gets to the shantytown.
But I am not sure how I could even get the junior maid (and even the knight) to cooperate with the plan—since they are more aware that something bad can happen—and they could get in serious trouble with the duke. Even if she fakes an illness and the junior maid says she does not want to be disturbed in her room—is it plausible that she would not be caught for 8 hours? Maybe, I could have it discovered by the staff a few hours isn that she is gone but they are too terrified to do anything about it?
Anyway, if you are up for talking about this more—I would love to hear it. Sorry, if it sounds like I am being inconsistent or holding important things back—I am really working through this in my head—(I am not trying to be difficult). This is incredibly helpful and additional thoughts are super-appreciated! -
How about this?
The 10yo talks to the junior maid about visiting her home. The junior maid does not take the girl seriously and essentially says she is welcome anytime. The 10yo then sneaks out in a plain clothes and shows up at a previously disclosed place outside the estate where the junior maid meets her uncle once a month to be escorted back home. The biggest obstacle is convincing them to bring her home. Again—this has to make sense for a 10yo—it is a little comical—but arguably plausible. -
@jazzyjeoff said in JNC Writing Support Group:
How about this?
The 10yo talks to the junior maid about visiting her home. The junior maid does not take the girl seriously and essentially says she is welcome anytime. The 10yo then sneaks out in a plain clothes and shows up at a previously disclosed place outside the estate where the junior maid meets her uncle once a month to be escorted back home. The biggest obstacle is convincing them to bring her home. Again—this has to make sense for a 10yo—it is a little comical—but arguably plausible.You could add an inconvenience for them to bring back the girl and they essentially decide to take her with them to which they would consider it to be safer. Like they need to leave immediately or it could be dangerous or they are going to miss their mean of transportation.
If they go on foot, maybe make the girl disguise as commoner and ask them for help to arrive at the maid's area.
If they are on a carriage owned by the uncle she could hide between their things and be discovered in the middle or end of the journey and the reasons above to not bring her back immediately.Regarding not being discovered is hard because of the time constrain as the mansion's employees would certainly notice considering the meal's time like lunch or dinner. You could say that the Duke and her wife are out for business, maybe even a long trip, few days for example. Then you can make the staff look around discreetly after they discover. You could even make the junior maid a "Heroine" for bringing the Duke's daughter back safely without the family knowing. Depending on this you could even extend to an entire day absence. Of course this will result in some consequences.
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@jazzyjeoff said in JNC Writing Support Group:
Anyway, if you are up for talking about this more—I would love to hear it. Sorry, if it sounds like I am being inconsistent or holding important things back—I am really working through this in my head—(I am not trying to be difficult). This is incredibly helpful and additional thoughts are super-appreciated!
You're fine! You're not being difficult in the least :) Having more details means we can give better advice, and I'm definitely up for discussing this or other details as much as you like.
The way I wrote it is that since she is just ten, she doesn't have ladies in waiting—there is just a head maid (nanny) and junior maids who have no status. So the maid that she would be leaving with is a junior maid—and the “princess” would be pretending to be a junior maid-sculiry maid. (FWIW, she would not be a princess (duke’s daughter) until she is confirmed in the church at age 12). Other than distinctive looks—acting like a commoner won't be that hard (for reasons).
A lady-in-waiting is completely different from a lady's maid. Ladies-in-waiting are nobles who complete tasks like overseeing a princess/queen's wardrobe, handle correspondence, manage her schedule, etc. They wouldn't handle chores like cleaning or serving tea--those are jobs the maids would handle. Serving a duke's daughter requires a lot of skills that a maid who just washes dishes and runs petty errands wouldn't have. Even though both are commoners, there would be a clear gap in status and pay between the two.
The downside of option 2 is a loss of drama and tedious logistics—part of the fun of having the protagonist be a child is that she does not have an adult’s appreciation of risk—and would go into a shantytown only accompanied by a junior maid. In other words, ten-year-olds do stupid things—and I want to embrace that! I just need a plausible way to get her out of the estate for 8ish hours disguised as a lower level maid—she can even fail spectacularly once she gets to the shantytown.
Maybe you could have her come up with her own plan and then get caught by the guard and the junior maid, who decide that it's less risky to accompany her to shanty town than risk her sneaking out on her own over and over.
Even if she fakes an illness and the junior maid says she does not want to be disturbed in her room—is it plausible that she would not be caught for 8 hours? Maybe, I could have it discovered by the staff a few hours isn that she is gone but they are too terrified to do anything about it?
If she fakes an illness, they would definitely be checking on her frequently to see how she's doing. Perhaps you could have the staff react by discreetly searching for her, not wanting to advertise the fact that she's missing just yet for fear that seedy elements might start looking for her and find her first. You may be able to hide this from her parents by having them visiting another noble when the discovery is made. The servants/guards then decide to keep her escape a secret when she turns up safe and sound, because all of them would be punished for failing to keep her from sneaking out.
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@Alfaerin I think I figured it out—at least figured it out enough that it is worth writing up and see how it works— (hoping I can get y’all to read it fresh—so I am not going to spoil it). Thanks a bunch! (I don’t know about you guys, but I happy for any writing distractions, while we are waiting on the announcement).
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@jazzyjeoff said in JNC Writing Support Group:
(I don’t know about you guys, but I happy for any writing distractions, while we are waiting on the announcement).
I was able to stay calm for the most part, but now I find myself feeling restless and nervous, ahaha. I would definitely welcome a distraction right about now.
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@Alfaerin Yeah, I should be writing—especially since I have some new ideas that I am sort of excited about—but instead I have been bouncing between the forums, outlook and discord for any news on the contest—so sad!
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The results of round one are out. I hope everyone had good news.
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1XmRmqSbTkoZ46uYDZfDKdRhPXH-zweqy1pBvAiXZtcw
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@Damon-Cavalchini no good news for me I'm afraid. Worst part about it is not receiving any feedback either. Congratulations to all who passed, good luck further :)
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@LeeroyCGNA said in JNC Writing Support Group:
no good news for me I'm afraid.
Me neither.
Worst part about it is not receiving any feedback either.
In the world of publishing, a rejection slip is a rejection slip, I guess. Still, an indication of whether a novel was rejected because it was no good or because it wasn't the sort of novel they were looking for would have been useful.
Congratulations to all who passed, good luck further :)
I'll drink to that!
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Hi there,
I’m sorry you both didn’t get through but as I’ve said before the very act of submitting was a win (think how many billions didn’t).
I’ve entered plenty of competitions where I have gone nowhere.
If everyone is happy, we could do a list of who here did progress so we can know who to cheer on for the next round (which has another large cut).
I think they said 83 or 84 novels got through out of 464 which is a huge filter process.
