Please don't take liberties on names when its not the same as the light novel/web novel....
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I’m fine with Garfield, though I would’ve preferred a stereotypical household cat name, like Mittens.
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@myskaros said in Please don't take liberties on names when its not the same as the light novel/web novel....:
@invayne Extrapolation. The number of people who are willing to come here and post questions represent the silent majority who just get confused and decide not to buy more books in the series.
That isn't necessarily true though. If you were to say that, you could also say that the people willing to come here and post complaints represent the silent majority who don't like the translation and decide not to buy more books in the series.
Honestly, I don't really see how Garfield is funny in the same way as Nyantaro. It would be more like Joe Meow (totally worse than Nyantaro) or Kitty or Mittens.
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Famous fictional (or real world) cats:
- Felix
- Garfield
- Puss in Boots
- Morris (Sold 9 Lives cat food)
Add more if you can think of any.
Regardless, using Garfield (with the lasagne poke) probable was the most recognizable to English speaking readers. Not 100%, but greater than a literal translation. Certainly funnier.
Puns are subtle humor. Sometimes they will even go past native speakers without any response.
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@legitpancake Or Pussy.
As someone who read the WN previously I can understand that you are miffed that they changed it this way. Arguable if Garfield is a good choice. But as I am fluent in enough languages I can understand the translators in trying their best to preserve the joke AND the original context. Puns are some of the most difficult things to translate in another language. Except maybe a text in prosa form. Man I would never like to localize 'Paradise Lost' from John Milton in my mothertongue. But this is besides the point. Should we name him "Meow upright"? Just to preserve the name (and I don't know the used Kanji, so I don't know if it was meant to symbolice him being male 'eldest son' for example, or upstanding, heroic, etc). I think such translations have a fine line in which you can either stay 100% authentic or take liberties for something equal.
I stated once in another thread that I don't understand some translation choices for other works. I took Game of Thrones as an example. Why do we need to localize the names? But for an obscure name like Nyantaro? I would have also chosen a name in where everyone can see, that he was made from off.
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@paul-nebeling said in Please don't take liberties on names when its not the same as the light novel/web novel....:
Famous fictional (or real world) cats:
- Felix
- Garfield
- Puss in Boots
- Morris (Sold 9 Lives cat food)
Add more if you can think of any.
Regardless, using Garfield (with the lasagne poke) probable was the most recognizable to English speaking readers. Not 100%, but greater than a literal translation. Certainly funnier.
Puns are subtle humor. Sometimes they will even go past native speakers without any response.
Who is Garfield anyways? I know Puss in Boots, but Felix? Garfield? Morris?
Like, seriously. Knowledge of those names aside... How are any of them funny?
Puns can be subtle humor, but if Garfield was supposed to be a pun, then why change the name at all? I can't even see how Garfield would be a pun unless you read it in Japanese.
Mittens and Kitty are two common cat names and definitely more insulting.
Winning isn't really that fun if you want a challenge... Making others win, on the other hand...
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@sinnoaria this is exactly whatI'm talking about. why change the name of a (spoilers here)
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@sinnoaria Garfield is a cartoon/comic cat who was created by Jim Davis in 1978. It's been running daily in newspapers ever since, the most recent figure I could find is 2,600 newspapers in 111 countries with around $1 billion a year in merchandising revenue. A total of 135 million Garfield comic books have been sold. I don't think you can pick a fictional cat that would be more widely recognized. Puss in Boots (a little known historical character before Dreamworks put him in a few films) is practically a footnote in comparison.
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@guspaz And that just means it makes even less sense for Garfield to be picked. That is more like praise. Puss in Boots is a relatively well known cat, although the fame will vary depending on the naming and might not be as popular with modern society.
Again, it doesn't really make sense to go off of a fictional cat name. Like, just for the sake of trying to be funny, you get rid of one aspect of the name?
Like I said elsewhere, you wouldn't name Khan and Alexander and so on "Ruler" because they are names. Because it is a name, a proper noun, you wouldn't give Rasputin another name such as "First Zombie" (Well, that is more like a title), or "Zombo". What happens if the author, for whatever reason, ends up adding a character named "Garfield"? Do we rename the second one into Nyantaro?
Winning isn't really that fun if you want a challenge... Making others win, on the other hand...
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Welcome... to Zombo Com
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@guspaz That is so horrible on so many levels... I can't even take it seriously at this point.
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That's 90s Internet memes for you. It's remained completely unchanged for 19 years.
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So long as zombo com doesn't mean we get stuff like goatse back
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After noticing this I’ve made an executive decision to change this for the ebook.
He will now be named Mr. Mittens.
Garfield was a poor localization choice that seems out of place for Japanese touya to know that reference and is too obvious a localization rather than a translation.
Keeping nyantaro without any localization is still a bad idea as people have expressed in this thread.
Thanks for the feedback.
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@sam-pinansky said in Please don't take liberties on names when its not the same as the light novel/web novel....:
Garfield was a poor localization choice that seems out of place for Japanese touya to know that reference and is too obvious a localization rather than a translation.
Keeping nyantaro without any localization is still a bad idea as people have expressed in this thread.
Thanks for the feedback.While I can't say that I completely agree with the localization issue, at least the new translation choice feels a bit more in-line with the original intent behind the character's naming choice.
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@sam-pinansky said in Please don't take liberties on names when its not the same as the light novel/web novel....:
After noticing this I’ve made an executive decision to change this for the ebook.
He will now be named Mr. Mittens.
Garfield was a poor localization choice that seems out of place for Japanese Touya to know that reference and is too obvious a localization rather than a translation.
Keeping nyantaro without any localization is still a bad idea as people have expressed in this thread.
Thanks for the feedback.
Thank you! And yes Mr. Mittens is a lot better in this sense. I appreciate the change.
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@sam-pinansky I've got no idea how well known Garfield is (or isn't) known in Japan, but I can agree with it being more localization than translation. Mr. Mittens brings to mind certain markings on a cat, so I'll need to go look at the picture of him to see how fitting it is.
Edit to add:
He is clothed pretty much from head to toe, including gloves, which on a cat's paws probably would resemble mittens. The comment about being swindled out of a fresh lasagna will need to be changed as well. Garfield is associated with lasagna. A regular cat? Nope. Doesn't make sense. -
@paul-nebeling Yeah we'll make sure to fix that too.
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I’m happy for the change, but you don’t have much time lol. Comes out on Amazon in 5 days, and they probably have a deadline for finalized edition.
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@sinnoaria Sorry, but can you stay at one standpoint. 3-4 postings above you are against the name because who knows Garfield. Then after someone reminds you that Garfield is more known as the "Puss in boots" you change it that it is simply not funny and makes no sense?
I get it that you are simply unhappy that a Pun in japanese gets changed. But what about the majority of the people reading this, who don't understand this? Should they simply learn the aspects of a language to apreciatte this? Maybe that you get my point. Some centuries ago it was the norm to hold the church in latin. A language which many could not speak. But yeah it was part of the lithurgie so why change it? Only that everyone can understand it? I don't know but I find a mess which you can understand better.
Yeah we can add footnotes, translator notes, etc. But for something which only exists to make fun of him? Why not name him in a way that says that Touya doesn't take him seriously. As I said previously it is arguably if Garfield is the best choice. But it is one which is easy to understand. As said, "Meow Hero". Would this fit better? It just doesn't flow like the japanese variant.
Ultimately there are different aspects what is better. Literal? Liberal? This is up to the translator. And I don't see it is a crude error that he made this judgement. Maybe if I give you a saying in my language you will appreciate a translator which can give it a better context. Here we say "Aus einer Mücke einen Elefanten machen" which literally translates to "making an elephant out of a fly". Now I wonder if this idiom is well known in english and if it would not be better to say "storm in a water glass" which can be understood by everyone.
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@saskir I never changed my stance. That is two different issues you are talking about. It is like saying that because I'm the most evil being on the planet, I'll do evil things. No, because I'm the most evil being, I'd rather just watch humans destroy themselves without lifting a finger. Evil mindset != Evil actions. Conversely, a good being could do evil actions. Two different issues.
I said that I don't know Garfield, but knew Puss in Boots and I didn't find either funny or sensible. Especially considering the intent behind the naming.
It is the same reason I got annoyed at How NOT to Summon a Demon Lord Vol. 5. They kind of change the character's normal thought process in order to get rid of the overpowered gear. It might not have been a huge change, but it felt unnatural.
Naming someone after a noble or respected (I'm assuming Garfield is respected) character in order to harass them... Seems unnatural.
That and the many other issues that can result from renaming. I understand that most people wouldn't understand the original names sometimes, but there are LNs out there that still sell well despite not renaming and those LNs so it isn't like not renaming automatically means that a series will fail.
With the many different methods of translation, you tend to see more Liberal (localization) translations from official sources, which is why I generally prefer the unofficial translations (usually more Literal) even if I am willing to buy the official source. It is why I usually respect companies that don't try to get rid of the unofficial versions - they let me buy the official and still enjoy whichever version I prefer.
Here is what I said. I'll snip off the unnecessary parts.
@sinnoaria said in Please don't take liberties on names when its not the same as the light novel/web novel....:
Who is Garfield anyways? I know Puss in Boots, but Felix? Garfield? Morris?
Like, seriously. Knowledge of those names aside... How are any of them funny?
Note: "Knowledge of those names aside" before "How are any of them funny?" meaning I'm putting them as separate issues.
Note: "Who is Garfield anyways?" with "I know Puss in Boots, but Felix? Garfield? Morris?" meaning I don't know them, not that other people don't.
Also, sorry if I make elephants out of flies. I mean, not like the fly needs their body after they die right? In seriousness, I've seen little things that build up and end up resulting in something major. Even if I didn't have any settings other than 0% or 100%, I'd still go all out as a result of seeing little things lead to major things. I didn't stop a person who I saw was about to die by talking to them for a few seconds longer. They died after because of something that small. I saw a kid who was about to die and didn't act to save them. They died when all it would have taken to save them was something as small as a light nudge.
So yes, I do consider 'small' things to be on the same category as 'big' things. You aren't the same person as me, so I don't expect you to think the same way, but don't underestimate the importance of a fly, or a molehill, or even a water glass.
