[IMPORTANT UPDATE] New Subscription Tiers + Readers Library Now Live as of October 3, 2025
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@niq said in [IMPORTANT UPDATE] New Subscription Tiers + Readers Library Now Live as of October 3, 2025:
The real charm about catchups was that you could use the opportunity to get into a series you haven't read before and if you indeed caught up to the latest volume before the end of the month you could just continue following the prepubs - and that's completely gone now.
When I first started reading at JNC, that was true for me.
It hasn’t been true for me for a long, long time.
Basically, I try to read the first few prepub parts of every series that comes out - the only ones I haven’t were when the series blurb made it very obvious that it was Not My Thing. So I can’t remember the last time there was a series on catchup that I hadn’t read enough of to decide if I liked it - and if I did like it, I’d kept up with it in prepub and didn’t have anything to catchup on.
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@Gamen said in [IMPORTANT UPDATE] New Subscription Tiers + Readers Library Now Live as of October 3, 2025:
I mean, people were stockpiling credits before too. People were bulk-buying 100 credits on the Black Friday sales or something like that? My memory is fuzzy. Switching to coins on JNC's part was basically about being able to change prices. They didn't change anything else about it; you can still subscribe for a single month and stockpile coins, yes?
Also, coins support the rental system.... which I forget even exists.
Actually, on other (book!) stores I have "coins" on, they expire after a year! And they're not even purchased at a discount or anything. That's a bit worse than prices simply going up.
Here is my opinion on coins and credits: they both are an attempt to get our money first. For subscribers, they function as value-added to the service. For non-subscribers like me, they allowed us to put our money first in exchange for the discount (BF sales, etc.). The difference is that with credits, it is a promise that 1 credit = 1 book. I think that's fair trade--I gave them money first in exchange for discount, and they promised that each credit will be worth one book, old or new, when I decide to spend it.
I spoke on the topic a lot already, so I'll try to be brief, but with coins, they certainly removed the promise that 1 credit (= XXX coins) = 1 book. That's bad, but fine for new books--inflation and what's not. What is unacceptable for me is they also raise it for old books. It devalues the money I gave them (for coin buyers) and devalues the old sub tier (for subscribers). That, for me, is a breach of trust and certainly anti-consumer. It would still be barely acceptable if they gave plenty of advance notice. That wasn't the case, and at this point I must say that was by design.
For coin expiration, is that bookwalker? I think only coins you get as cashback expire. I'm fairly sure there are laws against expiration of digital currency bought with real money everywhere. And in any case, it's not very assuring that both JNC and BookWalker are owned by the same company.
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@niq said in [IMPORTANT UPDATE] New Subscription Tiers + Readers Library Now Live as of October 3, 2025:
No one is going to sue
JNC is a membership subscription service - what is included has changed - you are free to discontinue being a member, and have no financial obligation to JNC, and JNC has offered to refund any membership fees they still hold if you choose to sever your membership (if only it was so easy to quit being a member of a health club, or Columbia House back in the day)
no one is going to sue, because no one would win, because JNC's liability is limited- as a plaintiff what are you entitled to?
if you are an annual subscriber - you are entitled to a refund (pro rated) which JNC already offered
if you are month to month subscriber - what damages (financially) do you suffer going forward? you feel the subscription isn't worth the cost? you feel the terms changed in a way that devalues what you formerly got? don't pay going forward (but that doesn't 'harm' you) ... to sue you need to prove damages (or in some jurisdictions unfair business practices), and JNC offered cancellations/refunds - no one has obligations to pay. It's going to be a tough 'row to hoe'
if you stockpiled coins you going to sue because of inflation? (that's not going to work) ...maybe just maybe if enough customers had thousands of coins and filed a class action to get a refund - again 'damages' would be limited to the value of the coins
A regulatory agency might take action and say that because the terms of the contract/ what is included in membership (catchups) changed without adequate notice JNC should be penalized in some way...but in almost every case I've seen those types of cases only are enforced when changes in offerings occur without a remedy . All contracts (even implied ones) have an out (for both parties) or consequences for violating the terms. "we will provide this service, you will pay for it. If we don't deliver, you don't have to pay" or some variation thereof - JNC OFFERED REFUNDS OF UNUSED PORTIONS OF ANNUALMEMBERSHIPS, they offered anyone who wanted it an 'out' - it was good customer service and effective limitation of liability -
no one is going to sue, (and win) because no one was financially damaged
no agency is going to waste their time over the changes because JNC didn't break the law - yes they changed what is included, and yes they communicated poorly, but they offered refunds to cover, and no one has obligations to buy what JNC is selling
in my mind the issue isn't about legal liability, or financial obligation, it's about community. I thought JNC wasn't just a faceless corporation, that it was a club and I was a member, and as a member I would be in the loop of changes - I still think that many of the members and contributors to the fora (and many staff/translators/editors) feel that JNC is a community of enthusiasts first, and a corporate entity 2nd, but I also recognize the reality that corporate ownership brings (and sometimes that means deals are made and details are not shared, and I won't like them)
I read banned books
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@Jon-Mitchell said in [IMPORTANT UPDATE] New Subscription Tiers + Readers Library Now Live as of October 3, 2025:
I thought JNC wasn't just a faceless corporation, that it was a club and I was a member, and as a member I would be in the loop of changes
What's really crappy is that if you go back and pull up the news post about when they originally raised the prices they actually mentioned they would give advanced notice when it happens on their own site. And while I suppose technically they did, it was both a shorter notice period, and in fewer places than when they did it 3 years ago.
https://forums.j-novel.club/topic/5866/upcoming-jnc-light-novel-price-increases?page=1
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This isn't quite correct. In America when you sue for a class action they can award punitive damages.
In the UK when you sue you only get remedial damages.So loss is not necessarily the most relevant factor for America while it is for the UK and many European nations in regards to whether its worth litigating.
So its not always clear cut in regards to these sort of matters.
This is why you tend to see lots of class actions in America, but not really anywhere else.
In terms of breaking the law, I think you could very easily make an argument that this is predatory pricing and that Kadokawa sits within a monopolistic position within the market for Light Novels. However, anti-trust /competition authorities are notoriously useless and slow at doing anything.
In terms of other points, there are numerous regional protections both in America and Europe in terms of unfair contract practices/terms. Which unilateral changes with 0 notices very easily can be breaching. Even more so given the increased scrutiny on premium currencies, due to the loot box saga in Europe and America.
I think JNC has quite clearly from the get go been a corporation not a community. A community is people. A corporation is a business that seeks to maximize profits. Thankfully the Light Novel industry is a matured industry where you can go buy a fully translated book, unlike Webnovels from Korea where distribution could not be more predatory (Just have a look at Navier).
If you wanted a cooperative then translators would not be on contracted work, they'd get royalties for each publication they're involved in. But that isn't how business works, and translators are frankly abundantly available for low cost. In the same way artists get sent to the corporate grinder. Especially when you can hire people in countries with far lower living costs and wage expectations.
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@Tremarl Where are you seeing predatory pricing? As far as I can tell, Seven Seas, Yen Press, Viz Media, Crunchyroll, etc. are still in business and have not been driven out of the market. And it seems pretty clear that a publisher like Sol Press or Tentai books went out of business because of their respective owners' problems and not anything related to what J-Novel is doing.
As far as punitive damages it could be argued where J-Novel had good faith when making these changes (Kept a portion of the discount, held a YouTube stream clearly showing the changes). And proving malice in this case would be hard to do. I'm not seeing anything malicious or deliberate intent to cause harm on changing their subscription tiers.
I'm just not seeing it. Poor communication yes. But predatory pricing and deliberate disregard? No.
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@morbelek said in [IMPORTANT UPDATE] New Subscription Tiers + Readers Library Now Live as of October 3, 2025:
proving malice in this case would be hard to do
not just difficult, impossible to do. In a legal context, malice generally means a "desire to harm" or an "intent to do an unlawful act". My speculation, JNC didn't release info on the changes earlier because they either weren't fully baked, because the deal with SONY wasn't fully baked (or JNC was under obligation from SONY not to release details) or some combination of these factors.
I fail to see how anyone has standing to sue, how they suffered damages, when JNC doesn't obligate anyone to pay for month to month subscriptions and offered refunds of remaining annual portions - as I noted in detail that is how contracts work - when terms get violated there are remedies, a party to a contract isn't going to get a remedy beyond a refund unless a penalty for 'failure to deliver' is explicitly spelled out in the contract (a if a party fails to fulfill an obligation in a contract - you sue, if they fail in an obligation and offer a remedy - that case will be weak)
I guess I and some other commenters are just speaking past each other - I just do not see the 'injustice' that rises to the level of a violation of a contract (to an extent that litigation is appropriate)
JNC raised their prices (in 2 ways : straight forward price increase, and the reader's library offering), and made a deal to stream manga back catalog elsewhere. And everyone whom no longer wants to play, doesn't have to. keep your money, Beyond this how were you harmed? (and not "I want what I want, and I don't get it anymore and now I'm sad")
